We start things out by having Bill address the cancellation of UFO Hunters and he speculates on what factors led to the program's demise. He talks about some of the stories which he thinks UFO Hunters "got too close too" and may have sealed the fate of the program. He also reflects on some of the dealing with the network as the show was spiraling towards cancellation.

Following that, Nancy steps in to express skepticism that the program got "too close" to the truth and, thus, was axed. Nancy also shares her perspective on the last few years as UFO Hunters was being made. This leads to some discussion on the recent MonsterQuest episode which used pieces of an old UFO Hunters to debunk the Flatwoods Monster case.

Next we have the pair reflect on the pros and cons of the program, in retrospect, particularly all the drama it created in the UFO community. Nancy shares how issues involving people either cut from the show or never appearing on the program led to a "cauldron of hatred" aimed at the pair. Bill reveals that the events of the last few months may not be the end of their involvement in the TV industry. They speculate on potential TV projects and what might work best. This segues into Nancy sharing a hilarious story of "cloak and dagger" tip that she received recently and how it embodies the type of strange info they get from time to time.

The conversation then turns towards some of the frightening stories that Bill have covered over the years and he shares the story of being subpoenaed by the FBI regarding TWA Flight 800. This leads to some discussion on how important the UFO subject may really be to the government and the pair share different perspectives on this concept. Bill shares more details on the bizarre story of UFO Hunters early visits to Las Vegas where they may have stumbled upon a secret government project.

Going down a different path, we revisit the Birnes' entrance into the field of Ufology via the Col. Corso book The Day After Roswell. Nancy provides a wealth of additional insight into how The Day After Roswell developed. We hear about the early reaction from the UFO community to the release of The Day After Roswell.

This segues into the Birnes talking about their pre-Day After Roswell meeting with Jamie Shandera and how his psychic girlfriend told Bill he'd be the one to reveal UFO secrets to the world. This fabulous story takes a variety of twists and turns and culminates in an acrimonious meeting years later as the buzz on the book was reaching its heights.

Leaving The Day After Roswell behind, we pose the philosophical question of why Bill and Nancy stayed in the UFO field after the furor the book had caused and their limited glimpse of the ugly side of UFO studies. Nancy details how, based on her previous success in the newspaper and book industry, she aspired to tackle the magazine field as her next conquest. Nancy and Bill also reflect on the saga that was the transference of ownership of UFO Magazine.

The conversation then turns towards the attitudes in present day Ufology, notably the growing contingent of people who want to regulate UFO studies or force their means, methods, and perspectives on the overall field as a whole. This also extends to some discussion on the economics of Ufology and the misplaced perception that to make money off of the field is sacrilegious because the search for UFO answers is part of a "greater good." We also talk about these "true seekers," who judge others in Ufology for "not believing enough."

Bringing things down to a personal level, we find out about Bill Birnes' family background, including how his father was a vaudeville performer partnered with George Burns, which is the origin of the "Birnes" name. We also hear some stories from their filming roles in the recent Dwayne Johnson movie Race to Witch Mountain. Circling back around to UFO Hunters, Bill shares some stories about the budget issues surrounding the program and one tale of a person who was interviewed on the show and ended up on the cutting room floor due to technical issues surrounding the creation of the program.

Closing things out, we find out what's next Bill and Nancy Birnes, UFO Magazine, the UFO Hunters concept, and their new podcast Future Theater.

Popping in for a stop and chat, Micah A. Hanks discusses his new book Magic, Mysticism, and the Molecule. Micah provides a thumbnail look at what he explores in the new book and touches on DMT, monotomic gold, mystery cults, a psychomantium, Michael Jackson & mirrors, and more. You can check out an excerpt from Magic, Mysticism, and the Molecule here.

William J. Birnes is a New York Times best-selling author, a magazine publisher, and a New York literary publishing agent who has written and edited over twenty-five books and encyclopedias in the fields of human behavior, true crime, current affairs, history, psychology, business, computing, and the paranormal. As publisher of the nationally distributed "UFO Magazine," editor of The UFO Encyclopedia published by Pocket Books, and co-author, with the nation�s top radio talk-show host, George Noory, of A Worker In The Light and Journey to the Light, Dr. Birnes has added to his list of publications in the UFO/Paranormal field, which include: The Day After Roswell, Unsolved UFO Mysteries, and The Haunting of the Presidents. William Birnes received his Ph.D. from New York University in 1974 while he was an Instructor of English at Trenton State College in New Jersey where he taught structural linguistics and historical linguistics as well as literature and writing. Professor Birnes was a National Endowment for the Humanities Fellow, a Lily Post Doctoral Research Fellow at the University of Pennsylvania, and a grants award judge for the National Endowment forthe Arts. His websites are ufomag.com and futuretheater.com.

Nancy Hayfield Birnes is a writer, publisher, and editor. A summa cum laude graduate of Princeton University, she founded Shadow Lawn Press in 1983, and in 2003 she co-founded Filament Books, an electronic book clubin partnership with eBook Technologies, Inc. She is the editor of two editions of the McGraw-Hill Personal Computer Programming Encyclopedia, and has written two cookbooks: Cheaper and Better and Zapcraft, both of which have enjoyed multiple printings and a healthy afterlife on the web. Her first novel, Cleaning House, has been translated into six foreign languages and has been published in nine countries. She is currently a director and the editor-in-chief of UFO Magazine, an international monthly publication, as well as a host on Future Theater, a weekly radio program. Her websites are ufomag.com and futuretheater.com.

Topics Discussed
2 Hr 53 Min
Bill & Nancy Birnes

and Micah Hanks